i used to love this program, but now i am finding it such a chore to maintain.
for example, suppose i want to create a task.
it's easy enough to start the process, but then suppose i want to link it to a project. i have to click on link then find the project, often picking it out from a list of several other items. now suppose i want to link it to a contact. i have to repeat the same process. creating a task linked to several projects and contacts takes much longer than it should.

and this is the same problem with notes, opportunities, whatever.

anyone else agree?

I thought I was the only one. I switched from Act to Daylite and have had the hardest time.

If you select something in the main window (say a Project), then click on 'New Note' or 'New Task' or new anything, the project will automatically be linked. You should not need to hit that link button.

So we try hard to remember the context and do the right thing.

This is also true when you have something selected in the Quick Find & Global Find windows, the Due list etc...

Are you doing that? Or are you creating things out of context (i.e. you are creating a new note for an existing project while you are in the calendar).

I don't happen agree with you, but I'm sure there can be improvements. What would you like to see? For instance, how would Daylite know, other than you telling it, what or who to link an object to? AJ has pointed out that you can have these links made automatically when you have the appropriate starting point. Do you have any other ideas?

I think that what is confusing you and giving you a challenge is the variety of ways that you can do things. Run a little test using Act! or some other DB where you can add tasks to a particular contact. You will see that if you keep things limited the same way that you will have a similar number of steps.

However, with Daylite, you can initiate creating a task with or without the contact already chosen and ready to go and still link it up and link anything else that you want linked to it. And, if you find the main item that you want a task linked to before you start the linking process, you can initiate the creation of a linked task immediately.

Now, as Howard said, things can always get better. A good example of that is that there is no way to initiate a dialer task and have it linked to anything more than the contact/organization that you are dialing. It would be much better with the following features:

• ability to choose additional objects to link to while in the Dialer dialog (e.g. organization, opportunity, or project).

• ability to choose a previously created task to record the activity to rather than always creating a new task even one there is one previously made.

However, I have been using and installing CRM applications since 1987. This is a very powerful and easy to use application–that can still be improved.

Lawrence

In addition to the point about contextual linking, it sounds like you link objects the way you had to do in DL1.x?

In DL3, linking can be done via drag-and-drop which, in combination with using the Quick Find window, means I can link a new object to several other things all in about 15-20 seconds, or typically less than 5 if the original contact (and default org) was the starting point and hence auto-linked. So, the linking process I find one of the most powerful and *least* cumbersome parts of DL!

Nick

DayLite is a very powerful application. Yet it can be very simple to use and understand. From my experience as a Certified Elite Partner, the biggest mistake that can be made is to try to use too much of the application too quickly.

I believe in a 'crawl before you walk, walk before you run, run before you run with sissors...' approach.

For some of the larger installations, I will have an initial discussion session with a few of their key people. During that, we discuss each of the functions (typically using the Preferences as a guide) and how they could best use them. This tends to be more of a 'think-tank' session. Quite often they will bring up specific examples using their own clients, projects, etc.

When I train new users, I try to limit the initial training to 3 hours or less. I concentrate on the basics, creating contacts, organizations, tasks, appointments and using DayLite Mail Integration. I also review the other functions to make them aware of their existence. I also offer my opinion on the importance of some of the functions based on their particular requirements.

Then I 'push the users out of the nest' and let them fly on their own for 3-4 weeks. Then I will return, discuss any of the questions that have come up since the first training, and then move to some of the more advanced topics like Opportunities, Projects, etc.

I've been using the product for almost 3 years now. I'd guess that I am using roughly 60% of the application. Because I am currently sole proprietor, there are some functions (i.e. Teams) that are no use to me. There are others (like creating Tasks and Appointments from Mail) that are indispensable. And there are other functions that I want to implement, I just haven't had the time or need up to this point.

Amongst my customers, I will see individual users within one organization who will embrace the product and constantly be looking into more of the product's features. Others from that same organization will barely use what I've taught them.

One suggestion that I've made before and yes it is a bit of self promotion... Enlist the services of a Certified DayLite Partner. They can work with you, learn how your business operates and assist you in implementing DayLite for your specific business requirements.

As Mac users we tend to be spoiled by applications that are very intuitive. DayLite can be just as intuitive. Create a contact, create an appointment, create a task. If you look at it that way, it is simple.

However DayLite also has the power, flexibility, and functionality that makes it one of the most robust applications for any platform.

DayLite can be self-taught but that there is a learning curve involved. If you want to reduce that learning curve, consider finding a Partner who can help you maximize your use of the product.

Hope this helps,

My understanding is that Act *requires* that tasks be linked to a contact, which accounts for its more linear linking mechanism. Along with the freedom to link or not link, DL offers a variety of methods to link (as Scott said). That's much more appealing to me than Act's more limiting approach.

quote:

A good example of that is that there is no way to initiate a dialer task and have it linked to anything more than the contact/organization that you are dialing. It would be much better with the following features:

• ability to choose additional objects to link to while in the Dialer dialog (e.g. organization, opportunity, or project).

You hit the nail on the head there! I've got to tell you, there are a handful of things in DL that really seem like little issues, but that annoy me on a daily basis and this is one of them (coupled with the fact that, oddly, phone calls aren't properly classified as "Outbound Call" and instead marked as "To Do"). I've mentioned this before, but it's never been addressed. It's nice to see that someone else feels my pain!

>i used to love this program, but now i am finding >it such a chore to maintain.

I see you've never used Outlook.

A philosophical comment on the issue of "hard to use..."

At the dawn of my Macintosh life (1990) I was on a mission to find a contact manager. I'd found Chang Labs' CAT (Contact Activity Time)... but a friend had described it as "hard to use."

I eventually learned that to him--in the macho-ness of embracing Macintosh--"hard to use" meant that he had to open the manual occassionally & read it to grok how to use some feature.

Today, CAT has been offically dead for 10+ years & Daylite/Marketcircle looks to be a VERY viable product.

Could the product be better. I'm sure... but I've not used it enough yet to find major points of irritation.

The really good news though is that OS X v10.???? & Daylite are early in their life span. So I'm expecting things to only get better.

Perhaps if I were dependant upon a PDA, I'd have a different view, but for now I can wait until Apple & MarketCircle evolve the underlying plumbing.

GREAT product. Keep up the good work.

Many thanks.

I'm finding Daylite SO cumbersome and unproductive compared to ACT. Right now I have a list of about 10 things that are BIG problems for me. For example, as far as I can tell, if I have a huge project due today, it doesn't even show up on my calendar. And phone calls are just lumped into appointments or tasks. For me they are totally separate things. Plus, not being able to hide completed tasks, or completed appointments, is ridiculous. AND, my notes for a Group show every note I've ever written on individual contacts, without telling me what contact it's associated with. Now that's helpful.

I wish there were some sort of training for Daylite. There are definitely some benefits, but SO MANY productivity features have been taken away from me. I hope some former ACT users can tell me this improves......

There is training available for Daylite. We offer remote training using Webex webinar tools.

Things like showing/hiding your projects are things that can be covered in training. One of the things that most Daylite users love about the application is that there is no one fixed way to do things. That way you can learn different methods for doing things, then choose the one that works best for you.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeffrie Story:
I'm finding Daylite SO cumbersome and unproductive compared to ACT. Right now I have a list of about 10 things that are BIG problems for me. For example, as far as I can tell, if I have a huge project due today, it doesn't even show up on my calendar. And phone calls are just lumped into appointments or tasks. For me they are totally separate things. Plus, not being able to hide completed tasks, or completed appointments, is ridiculous. AND, my notes for a Group show every note I've ever written on individual contacts, without telling me what contact it's associated with. Now that's helpful.

I wish there were some sort of training for Daylite. There are definitely some benefits, but SO MANY productivity features have been taken away from me. I hope some former ACT users can tell me this improves......

Jeffrie,

First and foremost, if you don't like DL, no one is forcing you to use it. While this once was not the case, there are other CRM apps on the Mac. Since I'm a big fan of DL, I can't vouch for any one of them, but you do have your choices.

That said, some of the things that you mentioned seem to be quite basic issues that are covered in the manual, knowledge base, forums, etc., extensively. I realize that it's easy to say that things are basic when you know how to do them already, but a lot of the stuff really is pretty basic (we're not talking about complex reports here, after all).

I don't want to dissuade you from seeking out a consultant because I do think that the DL paradigm can take some getting used to (and a good consultant could probably give you a head start on that), but you might want to try to get a handle on the basics first. In any case, best of luck with DL. If it works for you, great. If not, I hope you find something that suits your needs better.

Jeffrie:

As others have said, DL is very flexible. That is what I take as the source of your problem. Well, that and that DL does not work the way Act! works. For me, I find that Act! is far too limiting. But, there are pluses there none-the-less.

If you take advantage of the forums, the on-line and personal training, and the on-line tutorials, however, you will find that you can tailor DL to easily surpass Act! and perhaps even your expectations.

BTW…in what region are you located? That would help with pointing you to nearby resources.